There’s been one very persistent rogue commenter on my original post about Prolacta.
She’s been insisting that Prolacta is doing great things, shaming me for writing the post, questioning my research, etc-. She claims to be the mom of a preemie and to know people who’ve used Prolacta’s products (could be true). Frankly, I figured she just had rosy glasses for Prolacta. Fine, I figured there’d be at least one. I addressed her comments and tried to move on.
But, she just wouldn’t quit, despite the fact that I addressed her concerns both publicly in the comments on the post AND privately via email. (She demanded proof that any mom has ever donated to one of these middle-man banks and then been upset to find out later that her milk went to Prolacta; I sent her a link to a mom on a forum complaining and upset over that very issue.)
I kept checking periodically for more comments from her, hoping that the issues had been put to bed. Another couple comments showed up from people just finding the post, and then another from her.
Lo and behold, this woman does social media work – marketing - for Prolacta. (All credit goes to blog reader and commenter @lauredhel for the catch!)
Ah-ha! NOW it makes sense.
I jumped on Google and did a quick search, and sure enough: Prolacta is listed as a client of hers. Guess she didn’t feel it was relevant to disclose her relationship with Prolacta. (She was too busy singing their praises and doing a poor job of undercutting me.)
Need proof? Here’s a screenshot of her LinkedIn profile:
She’s commenting on JWOC as ‘ElisaP’.* What I think happened, is that her email signature accidentally posted to the blog (you can answer comments via email with my commenting system). That’s my best guess, anyway. I don’t think she meant to reveal her identity.
ElisaP’s comment on JWOC, revealing her full name and title. (I have no idea what she wanted me to remove.)
So, now we know. It’s anyone’s guess, whether she was commenting personally or ended up here via a professional referral as a part of her services for Prolacta (I would assume negative PR on a blog fits under her duties as a social media contractor).
Me? I smell a mole. Or at least a troll. You?
I made the following comment privately, and I think it sums up a big part of this: Those who can answer criticism, do; those who can’t, censor. (Or in this case, create straw-man and ad hominem arguments and try to distract from the negative PR their client is receiving. Or that.)
Anyone want to make the case that Prolacta’s not shady? Bueller?
*Edited to add: (6/25/11, 3:24pm)
A couple things have changed since I originally posted this. First, all of “ElisaP”‘s comments have now been changed by the original poster to “Guest” with an anonymous email address.
Note to the original poster: comments can be altered online, but I get email notifications of everything that happens here. Also, you can change your email address and post name, but your IP address remains in the comment record.
I did some quick research on the IP addresses. There were three used over the course of “ElisaP”‘s and Lisa’s comments. All of them are from the Los Angeles metro area.
SO: Either someone really wanted to impersonate Lisa here, or these all came from Lisa herself. You be the judge!
And a final update: Prolacta has created a new page, “The Straight Scoop about Prolacta and Milk Donations.” I’m going to blog about that, too. It’s essentially a [very poorly executed] rebuttal of my original Prolacta post, “Swindled: The Ugly Side of Milk Donation.”
SEE THE POST HERE: Prolacta Responds to “Swindled: The Ugly Side of Milk Donation”
This is a post I originally wrote for Just West of Crunchy (6/25/2011), which now redirects to this site. I’ll be republishing my “Best of” from that site here at AmyWest.co. This post is still undergoing editing and updating as of 6/18/13. The original comments from JWOC are imported below.
NB: No one may republish this, translate it and republish it, or quote more than a couple lines of it without my express permission. I’ve given a few people permission to do things in the past (translate it, take my list and apply it to a specific group, like military moms, etc-) and I’m open to it, but ask first. If you take this and don’t ask, see #1 on my Disclosures.
The mole basically appear and takes place on any part of the body. Surgical removal of moles on the skin can be completed in the doctor’s office using local anesthesia. This is done in one day. However, the mole will need weeks to heal.
How on earth would “a long-time Communications and Social Media consultant” make such a clueless sort of “Please remove” blog post? Unless trying to look disingenuous and… I mean, that’s bizarre. “Please remove,” it’s 1994 and I just got my AOL CD in the mail and don’t understand, oh, help! From “a long-time Communications and Social Media consultant”? No, I don’t think so.
You go Amy West! This is very exciting and I’m so proud of you for your vigilance. Thank you.
<3
I love that she outed herself. Karma will always get you in the end! It pays to play nice.
You don’t even have to play nice….just honest would do!
you are failing to mention me…a very much pro prolacta person with no affiliation to prolacta… just to preemies. i emailed you last week and asked that you pleae give both sides of the story. i think that women should know that their breastmilk could go to prolacta if they donate to some places. but that prolacta is not the monster you make them out to be.
Emily, I’m responding to your email tonight. I copied and pasted Prolacta’s side of this in my last post on the issue, so I think both sides have been represented fully and fairly: http://justwestofcrunchy.com/2011/06/28/prolacta-responds-to-swindled-the-ugly-side-of-milk-donation/
Prolacta IS an evil corporation, I know, my husband works there! They are not in this for more than anything other than the almighty dollar. Don’t be so naive… it’s embarassing you are sticking up for a company you obviously no nothing about.
Amy, When Milkin Mamas are criticized on public forums by doula the company suddenly appears to defend and rationalize what they do, and posts this PR letter!!
I’m active on professional forums for doulas and childbirth educators, we are being solicited and marketed to by these for-profit banks who sell milk to Prolacta. They want us to give information to our clients. Doulas are refusing to be shills for these companies.
I’ve know about this problem since their inception, my mission is to make sure Doulas and CBE are not drawn in and fooled by them, they have to become aware and stop milk being diverted to these for profit companies!
I’m active on a professional doula forum site and last week we had been talking about Milkin Mamas and the problems with for profit milk banks ….. a day later suddenly the owner showed in our forum to defend for profit milk bank and the practices.
You can read her PR reply to the doulas in her letter below:
__________________
Milkin Mamas reply :
I am happy to
see that there is a discussion happening about breast milk donation, but I am
saddened that there is so much incorrect information being shared. I own Milkin’
Mamas along with my sister. We welcome any and all questions you may have
regarding milk donation through Milkin’ Mamas, we can only speak for ourselves
and what we do and we would like to hear from you. You can speak with us
personally by calling our office at 562-421-6969 or email us at
donate@milkinmamas.com.
Let me tell you who I am. First and foremost I am a mom, like most
of you. Over the past 20 years I have worked as a massage therapist,
specializing in pregnancy massage, a birth doula, a homebirth midwifes assistant
and now the owner of Milkin’ Mamas. I have supported hundreds of women through
their pregnancies and births and now I do so during their time as a lactating
mama. I am a HUGE supporter of breastfeeding and exclusively breastfed both of
my children until they were almost 2. I was one of those “super producing mamas”
that produced an excess 20-30 ounces of breast milk a day for over a year. I
became a milk donor myself when my first baby was just 7 weeks old and it was
one of the most rewarding experiences I’ve had. I can’t imagine having to throw
away so much milk everyday. Before I had my son I had no idea breast milk
donation was even possible and I found out about it by chance. I couldn’t
believe that ME, a doula and midwifery student/assistant didn’t know that milk
donation was available. For me milk donation was a blessing in two ways:
1. I didn’t have to waste one drop of the precious milk my
body was so abundantly producing and 2. tiny
babies who needed milk the most could benefit from it. I donated to a
Prolacta affiliated milk bank and I was proud and happy to know that my milk was
being used exclusively in the NICU for the ultra preemie babies. And yes, I DID
know my milk was being sold. That was perfectly fine with me and it made sense.
I didn’t think twice about it, I knew they had to test my milk and make it safe
for the babies who would ultimately receive it.
I’d like to address just some of the comments
posted recently. First of all YES, we are a for-profit milk donation program. We
get paid by Prolacta to inform and educate breastfeeding mamas about milk
donation, identify potential donors and to assist mamas through the process of
becoming a breast milk donor. Are any of you non-profit in your doula
businesses? Don’t you get paid for helping mamas through birth and into
postpartum? Isn’t this a valuable service that you should be paid for? Do you
not profit from your business? (These questions are not meant to be
mean-spirited, I ask to just make a point.) We help many babies get the best
start in life, as most of you do, and we get paid for it just as you do. Just
because we get paid for what we do doesn’t mean we aren’t doing good and we
aren’t helping many babies. And it surely does not mean we are taking advantage
of anyone. We personally speak with every donor (who voluntarily contacts us)
and we answer all their questions. Information about the milk being sold is on
our website and is part of the on-line donor application.
I feel that our
website is very detailed and tells our potential donors all they need to know
about becoming a donor and how their donated milk will be used. One of the
compliments we get most often is that our website is so easy to understand and
many questions were answered before even speaking with us. We welcome positive
criticism and will go back and look at our site again to see if there are ways
we can improve our site for potential donors.
Many people have no idea that there are many ways
to donate breast milk and the milk they donate goes to nourish many different
types of babies. The milk donated through Milkin’ Mamas goes to Prolacta
Bioscience. Once the donated milk arrives at Prolacta Bioscience’s lab, it is
made into human milk fortifier. Human milk fortifier is concentrated milk
protein that is added to the milk a premature baby’s own mother is providing for
her child. Some premature babies can weigh less than 3 pounds at birth.
These “ultra preemies” need
to receive extra protein and nutrition, more than their own mother’s breast milk
can provide. By adding human milk fortifier, you can up to triple the amount of
protein a premature infant can receive. Prolacta Bioscience is the only company
that makes human milk fortifier out of human breast milk. All other human milk
fortifiers are made out of cow’s milk. The human milk fortifiers made out of
cow’s milk can cause problems for premature babies because they are not natural
human proteins and the baby’s underdeveloped systems cannot always handle the
cow protein. The HMBANA milk banks (the non-profit banks) don’t create a
fortifier for babies in the NICU, they provide (for sale) pasteurized breast
milk. The pasteurized milk is used for many different babies, not exclusively
for premature babies. Both Prolacta and HMBANA fill a need in providing breast
milk to babies, but it is unfair to compare the two since the needs of babies
are so different.
We
are proud to be working with Prolacta Bioscience in helping NICU babies get the
nutrition they need. One comment was made that Prolacta Bioscience is owned by
Ross Labs, a formula company. This is untrue. Prolacta is a privately held
company. Prolacta does have a co-distribution partnership with Abbott, which
makes the fortifier available to many more babies in many more hospitals than
was possible before the partnership.
I know a lot was said about families not being
able to pay for the donated milk. I’m not sure if the persons making those
comments were talking about the fortifier that Prolacta creates or the donated
milk provided through HMBANA. In regards to the Prolacta fortifier, when it is
used for a NICU baby, it would be listed on the hospital bill, just as any other
medication, service or treatment the baby received would be. Either the hospital
or insurance company pays for the fortifier. The parents never pay directly for
the product. I would also like to agree with the comment of another poster. It
is true, the Prolacta fortifier may seem expensive, but when it is used, the
babies recover quicker with less complications and therefore shorten the babies’
hospital stay. This saves the hospitals and insurance companies thousands of
dollars.
Lastly, I
would like to comment to those who think we are taking advantage of
“unsuspecting moms”. I wake up every morning knowing that we are not only
helping so many tiny babies, but we are also helping mamas. We are helping them
in donating their milk so it doesn’t have to be wasted. Remember this is all
“extra milk” that is not going to be used by their own babies. I was one of
those mamas, I know from personal experience. If you have ever pumped and stored
breast milk, you know it takes a lot of time and effort, especially when you are
tired and trying care for a new baby. If you have ever even considered throwing
away one bag of milk, let alone several hundred ounces, you know it is heart
wrenching. Mamas in most states are not lucky enough to have a milk bank close
to where they live, HMBANA, Prolacta or otherwise. Milkin’ Mamas fills the void
in being able to collect milk from mamas across the continental United States
and we can collect milk that is up to 10 months old. Many of our mamas have had
miscarriages, fetal demises or gave a baby up for adoption. Being able to donate
their milk is a very comforting way to honor their babies and to help them
grieve.
We are always
coming from a place of love in all we do. I would urge you to contact us if you
have questions so you can make an educated decision for yourself.
Many
Blessings…
_______________________________________________
Sickening!
Wow. She doth protest too much…..
Wow… good work Amy! Something tells me this isn’t the last you’ve heard from Elisa/Lisa/whoever she says she is…
Awesome job Amy! I read the previous post as well. Thanks for showing these folks for who and what they are and helping to protect moms and babies in the process. Thank you for your hard work!
Oh. My. Word.
I said something like that when this hit the fan, too… ;)
Okay, I’m confused. Maybe it’s still too early. Definitely something shady is going on and perhaps this person is a troll or mole, but I don’t understand a few things. 1) Why on the original post is ‘ElisaP’ text gone and now replaced with ‘Guest?’ 2) If she was going back and forth with you to fight the criticism of Prolacta, why would she post the final message saying “I don’t know what this” (which also included her contact info and blew this out of the water). It doesn’t make sense for her to say that as her role as a mole. 3) But if what she is saying is true and she never posted the previous comments, it wouldn’t make sense her only admitted comment showed up as ‘ElisaP’ like the other comments as your screen shot shows. So I’m just plain confused. Can’t you tell by some fancy blog tool if all the comments were made from the same IP address?
The comments came from 3 different IP addresses, all in the Los Angeles area…where Lisa happens to live….
Hi, Amy. I am Lisa and I am the person whose e-mail
screenshot is above. I am a long-time Communications and Social Media consultant
and proudly consult with Prolacta. I can assure you that “Elisa P” is not me –
I do not have a baby, and do not volunteer in any hospital or NICU — nor is
“Elisa P” anyone else with my company, Counterintuity, LLC. As you are aware,
Disqus does not require an e-mail verification to register as a blog commenter.
Anyone can register any email address or name and begin using it right away. I
am, however, the one who sent the e-mail saying “Please Remove. I’m not sure
what this is” as I also did not sign up for any e-mail notifications for your
blog. While writing my reply this evening, my e-mail signature with contact info
was in full display on my screen. I was fully aware of what I was writing and
what information would be visible to the recipient. This demonstrates that I
have nothing to hide. We proudly proclaim our consultancy with Prolacta in our
social media posts, on our open -to-all LinkedIn pages (as you mentioned), on our blog
and in our email newsletters. Our association with them has been open and
transparent from the start. I would welcome a phone call from you on Monday to
discuss this or any other concerns you may have.
yah,righhhhhht~so sure. Why did it take you 2 hours to respond lisa? Full of crap that’s why-had to think up what you would come back with,that’s why.I smell something funky
Hi Sarah-It’s because I live in CA and have been at my best friend’s birthday party until just now — nothing sinister or “funky.” I can’t access the system via my phone. I welcome a call from you about your concerns, as well, and anyone else who responds to this thread with the same questions. We are all open to your concerns. Have a great weekend. Fondly, Lisa
Lisa, how did Elisa obtain your email signature and why was she posting it? I’m sure you can admit that this would lead us to believe that you and she are the same person, if she has no ties to the company, why was she posting your email signature?
I have allegiance with neither Amy nor Lisa, but I do want to say that someone could have accessed her signature by having received an e-mail by her. Just e-mailing her a simple question and receiving a response would have provided them with her signature. If anyone holds a grudge against Lisa then they could have impersonated her and tried to get her in trouble with her job.
You’re right that this would be possible. But the rationale behind why someone might do this makes it even LESS likely that ElisaB and Lisa are different people. Following your scenario, ElisaB deciding to act on this grudge by appearing to be a Prolacta social media contractor only *undermines* her own argument (and this is before she changed “ElisaB” to “Guest”, which, I mean, come ON), so what in the world would she have been trying to accomplish??
It’s true that the means are possible. But the motivation would thus make absolutely no sense. What we clearly have is a PR person attempting to engage social media with a really, REALLY shady faux-story meant to manipulate people’s emotions -and then bungling the whole thing in an unbelievably embarrassing way. I almost feel sorry for her.
ALMOST.
Yup. What Anne said!
I agree with everything Anne said. While this all could be a big fat coincidence….the odds are pretty darn slim that it could have happened that way.
Evidence and odds that it was Lisa, however, are pretty strong….
Lisa, here’s my take: Either someone went very, very far out of their way to comment as you, from IP addresses in your area….or it was you.
And I think it was you.And exactly what were you responding to with “Please remove. I’m not sure what this is”? That was the post that tipped us off in the first place, it wasn’t posted in the aftermath of the reveal of your identity.
TOO FUNNY! FUMBLE MUCH????? LOL
WOW……I found the original post about prolacta through facebook a couple hours ago and read the article along with all the comments.Well I was pleased but not surprised when the last comments showed she actually works for prolacta !?!?!?!?! “Online reputation management” huh? When I read “ElisaP’s” last comment I was about to ask her if she worked for them or something because she sure was reacting like she was on damage control duty for Prolacta themselves ~ and then I saw lauredhel’s comment about ElisaP working for Prolacta.CRazy!!!! Ive had posts and comments of mine deleted over and over again on facebook concerning breastfeeding and formula company tactics and I’m wondering if they pay facebook to manage their company’s and product’s online reputation( facebook is the world’s largest social network and person to person is the most effective form of advertisement) It’s like the friggin matrix !
It IS like the friggin’ Matrix LOL!!
OMG WOW!!!! That is hilarious! I am so glad I never gave my milk to this place. I use to donate directly to a milk bank that supplied babies in need, but then found moms locally who were in need.
“I would assume negative PR on a blog fits under her duties as a social media contractor”
Yep. Her marketing company does “online reputation management”. This is a leaf straight out of other formula companies’ playbooks – except for the amateur stuff-up leading to the reveal.
Perhaps her ex-company, at this point!
Wow! Oh Amy, this lady outing herself on accident is like a gift from Baby Jesus!
Right?!